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2K BlackMagic Pocket Cinema Camera, active m43, $995
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  • last_SHIFTlast_SHIFT

    @No_SuRReNDeR

    B & H is great and all, but even if they get the 'largest' shipment - they are also getting the largest amounts of pre-orders. So it could be a blessing or a curse - case in point, there was a huge preorder fiasco with the D800 as Nikon was unprepared for the huge response, people were waiting months and months to get their orders filled. Many folks were able to get lucky with some mom and pop shops and cancelled their pre-orders after many moons of waiting.

  • peternappeternap

    @No_SuRReNDeR I've had good luck with B&H and Adorama in the past. I have my order in with B&H right now but may change if it looks like a long line.

  • ahblezaahbleza

    I ordered a BMCC MFT from B&H back in September. I just received it today. I've also ordered a BMPCC, and expect it by the end of August.

  • No_SuRReNDeRNo_SuRReNDeR

    After a huge debit card fiasco.... I was finally able to order mine and have them charge the full amount upfront...thanks all --- I plan on shooting a most of short film in Oct on the Camera so hope I get it before that. Thx all

  • jimmykoreajimmykorea

    @vicharris. True Wedding videos need longer than 10 minutes. A standard roll of 35mm film of 1000' however runs at about 11 mins at 24fps.

  • mrbillmrbill

    Yawn

  • MikhailKMikhailK

    @No_SuRReNDeR As for your hopes for B & H..., as it was told by @last_SHIFT, all dealers have a lot of pre-orders. So in any case you gotta stand in line :-)

    I've placed my order (BMPCC) in the beginning of June with one of the largest Russian dealers. I asked this dealer if there's a chance to get BMPCC faster and I was told that all I can do is "wait in the line" (my number was 12...) and I will get my order in October only.

    I asked them - WHY does it take that long? They told me that Blackmagic Design has informed all the dealers around the world that "in order to have a fair competition" all dealers will get the same quantity of BMPCCs "per each month"!

    It's very sad in case it's true.

  • MovieArmadaMovieArmada

    @MikhailK yeah but has been some problems with the availability of older BMD cameras in Europe so I think Grant Petty is on top of it. The problem is that US dealers pre-order hundreds of cameras as soon as they are announced and some dealers only post their orders when clients actually order them. It works both ways but I think BMD is trying to keep things "fair".

  • double_visiondouble_vision

    newbie question here. Is there any exposure meter in the blackmagic camera interface? If no, how do we know the exposure is at "0" value? I also heard that the exposure when shooting raw video doesn't really matter, because you can always change it during post production. Can someone clarify this?

  • eatstoomuchjameatstoomuchjam

    Raw isn't magic. You still need to expose correctly (and "0" isn't always correct for a given scene).

  • double_visiondouble_vision

    If you don't mind, could you elaborate more?

  • MRfannyMRfanny

    shoot like you shoot a roll of film. get your exposure right. RAW is a lifeline not a saviour. Otherwise why bother exposing correctly in the first place. Do you have time to fiddle in post? Most people don't have that luxury.

    correct exposure depends on what mood you want to achieve, lighting, subject matter, etc. to tell a story, therefore "0" isn't always correct.

    but back on topic =) I myself would like to see the difference in IQ from the 2.5k BMCC vs BMPC and dynamic range, active(if it is active on the BMPC) vs passive MFT lens mount. I watched the clip comparing the 5dmiii vs BMCC and was just blown away.

  • balazerbalazer

    What is 0 EV?

    I think the whole point of the Blackmagic cameras is that the raw and film log video they record is not display referenced, like rec.709 and sRGB are. The Blackmagic cameras record a wide range of RGB levels - much wider than your display will show. And it's up to you how you want to map the wide dynamic range that the camera records down to a smaller dynamic range that a TV can show. Large parts of the input range must be discarded or significantly compressed. You can try to use a fixed mapping and always expose your footage the same way, or you can vary the exposure and the mapping shot-to-shot.

    Download some ungraded sample Blackmagic footage and stick it in your favorite NLE or Resolve, and play around with different ways of mapping the levels for your display.

    Being able to capture a wide dynamic range doesn't mean you can stick the scene just anywhere in the camera's range. Different parts of the camera's range behave differently in terms of noise, color rendition, and transfer function. The transfer function is not perfectly logarithmic. With some practice you'll find good and bad ways to expose for the camera. There isn't a single correct or best way to do it, and that's part of the beauty of the camera.

  • eatstoomuchjameatstoomuchjam

    With BM raw, you get 12 steps of dynamic range. With Magic Lantern on a 5D Mark III, you get around 14 steps of dynamic range. Each step represents a doubling of the amount of light available in the previous step. Generally speaking, the "best" portion of the range in terms of noise, detail, etc. is somewhere near the center of the range, though in some cameras it skews a bit to the upper or lower portion. The brightest highlights and darkest shadows are both likely to get noisy and/or lose some detail. So, it's better to understand your camera and how it works before shooting, even if you have raw to help you salvage technical mistakes. Being 2-3 stops underexposed with h.264 is pretty bad. Being 3 stops underexposed with raw isn't great, but probably not fatal. Being 8 stops underexposed with raw will still probably result in footage that you can't use.

    In terms of why "0" on the over/under exposure guide on your camera isn't always right, if you're shooting soemone who is backlit by a window, for instance and you're using center-weighted average metering, there's a pretty good chance that the metering system in the camera is going to end up exposing more for the light coming through the window. You might get a beautifully exposed scene of the nature outdoors and unrecoverable shadows on the person in front of it.
    You're better off using a histogram (or similar). It gives a nice breakdown of luminance values across the scene and you can decide for yourself where you'd like to place the exposure to set the right mood for your scene (as others have pointed out, there is no correct exposure, even if there are completely wrong ones. :) If you're shooting run-and-gun and don't feel like you have time to nail exposure on every take, it would also be wise to read up on the different metering modes supported by your camera and when you might want to use them.

  • bwhitzbwhitz

    With BM raw, you get 12 steps of dynamic range. With Magic Lantern on a 5D Mark III, you get around 14 steps of dynamic range.

    Not really. The current Blackmagic cam is rated at 13... and I don't think anyone has really disputed that. The 5D has maybe 12... on it's best day. Nowhere near 14.

    You might be thinking of bit-depth. Where Blackmagic RAW is 12... and the 5DIII is 14. But that doesn't always equate to dynamic range.

  • RRRRRRRR

    @Tschekoff

    I don´t get why it should be a problem to switch cards every 40 minutes of recorded material unless you absolutely need a longer recording (in which case I will use other cams). Nor is it any problem to kit up a camera if you need something in particular.

    I´ve shot a lot with 16gb sandisk cards with settings that swallowed 1gb per minute and it was completely OK to work with. Kit up with enough cards. I have 2 64gb sdxc cards and I wouldn´t mind getting a couple more.

    People seem to be clutching at straws when it comes to perceived weaknesses with this cam. Yes, an articulated screen is easier to work with and in terms of minimalist shooting but you have to weigh in what´s most important for you in any given scenario. Complaining about features missing or having to mount a monitor or something else is kind of ridiculous (not saying you did, just people in general in this thread).

    Personally, I will make good use out of the pocket cam as a fast b-cam or if shooting exteriors on the go / with minimal preparation or some kind of stealthy work. I will use other cameras when necessary. I wouldn´t even dream about complaining about the lack of wide angles because I so rarely need to go really wide; even an 18mm on a 35mm frame size (which is really wide angle for cinema) is not that wide in comparison to what you can put on a full frame stills cam. (other sensor sizes too, but really wide lenses often look bad on video / film) It´s very rarely necessary and in those cases; plan ahead - use another cam for such shots.

  • bwhitzbwhitz

    People seem to be clutching at straws when it comes to perceived weaknesses with this cam.

    +1

    People simply need excuses for when their work doesn't turn out that good. They don't want to blame themselves or their talent level... and with affordable RAW cams coming out this year... there are very little scapegoats left. Hence the reason people are using inane reasoning, like recording time... which effects your work about 0.000%. Unless you're recording live events with these cams, which is really weird and dumb to do.

    Seriously, if you're complaining about switching cards every 40mins... then you should probably get out of this industry/art form. You're not cut out for it. Sorry. Nobody "owes you" a perfect (infinity-record time?) workflow. Make good projects, or don't.

    You think the audience is really going to feel the impact of you switching cards every 40 mins? Like film for the last 100 years was magical? ...and flew down from the sky into you camera? People do understand that there's editing in movies right?

  • balazerbalazer

    Unless you're recording live events with these cams, which is really weird and dumb to do.

    I hope you can see the hypocrisy of what you just wrote.

  • bwhitzbwhitz

    @balazar

    Nope. What is it?

    This...

    unless you're recording live events

    ?

    Well, yea... Who would be using RAW (or high-bit rate prores) cine-cams for live-events? That's what broadcast cameras and "video" cams are for. Different tools altogether. I put that in more as an disclaimer of a really dumb use of these cams... not as a real-life possible scenario.

  • Brian202020Brian202020

    "You might be thinking of bit-depth. Where Blackmagic RAW is 12... and the 5DIII is 14."

    I believe when shooting RAW the BMD camera's are 16bit wrapped in a 12bit container, and Resolve unwraps it back to 16bit.

  • RRRRRRRR

    @bwhitz I think you´re right. As equipment gets better and more easily available, people get all the more inventive with excuses and complaints about all kinds of things. On a personal level, the only thing I still miss is a nifty (small) hybrid cam where you don´t have to sacrifice either stills or video quality. With that said, I find myself a lot more interested in other kind of gear (than cameras) these days.. Not that I can complain too much about what we normally have available to us.

  • johnbrawleyjohnbrawley

    The BMCC is greater than 16 at the sensor. Then 16bit LIN gets converted to 12bit LOG to DNG. Then in Resolve goes back to 16bit LIN.

    JB.

  • bwhitzbwhitz

    @johnbrawley

    Awesome! Thanks for the confirmation.

  • Brian202020Brian202020

    "The BMCC is greater than 16 at the sensor. Then 16bit LIN gets converted to 12bit LOG to DNG. Then in Resolve goes back to 16bit LIN."

    Is this the case with the BMPCC and BMPC as well or just the BMCC?

  • balazerbalazer

    The cis1910 is the sensor suspected to be in the BMPCC: http://www.fairchildimaging.com/files/data_sheet_cis_1910f_0.pdf

    It's a smaller, newer version of the cis2051, supposedly the chip used in the BMCC. http://www.scmos.com/files/high/scmos_white_paper_8mb.pdf

    They both have a pair of 11-bit ADC outputs per photosite with independent gain settings. The BMPCC records 12-bit log in raw, and 10-bit log in ProRes, just like the BMCC.

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