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GoPro Hero3 , 4K is here in Baby Steps for $399.99!
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  • trevmartrevmar

    IMAGE NOISE .. as far as I can tell, there are two modes where the image noise in low light is least obtrusive, and most easily filtered. These are 2.7Kcine Wide 24T and 1080 Medium 24T. I think the issue is that these resolutions match up closely with the native sensor resolution. Other shutter speeds should be equally good at these resolutions, but I haven't tested anything except 24T indoors. Am I right? Do you have a mode which exhibits lower noise than these two? Please let me know :)

  • trevmartrevmar

    I used Cineform Studio to create an AVI Cineform file (which has embedded metadata). While editing that AVI file in Vegas I can use Cineform Studio (or the "C" widget) to change the metadata interpretation in the decoder, and thus alter in real time alter what Vegas is working with... The AVI file contains metadata for the full Protune logarithmic range and Cinema Raw white balance, and it can be tweaked at any time in the processing chain.

  • stoneystoney

    @trevmar Did you import the original sources clips out of the camera into Vegas? Also are you using the free version or paid version of Cineform Studio?

    If Vegas uses Cineform 422 codec as edit/preview codec, it must be interpreting non-destructive metadata that Cineform Studio modifies. I'd try it out on PP & CS on OSX later.

  • trevmartrevmar

    @stonebat The OSX version seems very different from the Windoze version I am using. In Windows the integration of cineform with AVI is extensive. I can be doing my edits of the cineform files in Sony Vegas, for example, yet I can change the exposure in Cineform studio and those metadata changes are reflected in real time into the Sony Vegas preview and edits. With the Windoze Cineform chain, I haven't seen anything problematic while working with Protune. Admittedly, I have used the cineform AVI format as in editing intermediate for years, because it previews so quickly in Vegas and is essentially lossless.

  • 5thwall5thwall

    @Kihlian Chateau Crone - Album, Agent Ribbons - Song, "I'm Alright".

  • stoneystoney

    @trevmar I'm using OSX version of Cineform Studio. The gamma change setting isn't accessible from the app's preferences menu. I had to open the Mac's System Preferences. Then click Cineform settings icon. Then change the gamma setting. Tedious...

    Anyways the default gamma 2.2 made more contrast and more saturation for sure. Maybe that's not a bad starting point, but I'd like to carry the logarithmic curve all the way to tools like PP, FCPX, AFX. I presume gamma 1.0 wouldn't alter the logarithmic curve . Yes gotta retain 10 bit 4:2:2. Then do some color grading in 16bit or 32bit color space. Then apply gamma when exporting to final artifact. Well that's the idea.

    BTW I did see the GoPro Cineform encoder. Do they provide decoder, too? It would be nice if the decoder can read metadata and display source content in realtime on PP, FCPX, or AFX. If this is possible, I guess I don't need to transcode the source file into Cineform AVI (in my case MOV prores). That is importing the source files directly from my favorite editor.

  • BlueBomberTurboBlueBomberTurbo

    @trevmar Yeah, it's kinda rough indoors. Probably better off using 2.7K and cropping for that. But with decent lighting and light NR, it should be fine. I'll be doing outdoor tests at lunch today with 1080 and 720 Narrow, Protune vs standard.

    Also, I've found that converting to Cineform doesn't improve quality like 5DtoRGB does. It's pretty much just a direct conversion (minus any color/exposure tweaks). I'll be posting up a comparison shortly. For pixel peepers, it's a significant difference.

    @kellar42 You can get great detail and color out of 2.7K Protune in decent light. The biggest drawback would be the inability to control exposure.

  • kellar42kellar42

    Has anyone gotten a look at Hero3 footage on the big screen, yet? I am trying to decide whether it will be enough for a few aerial shots for a little indie feature, or whether to step up to something that will take a GH2. I've had commercials projected in movie theaters that used moments of the first HD Hero footage and it was OK for that purpose but not good enough for what I'm looking to do now.

  • trevmartrevmar

    @stonebat You have to use Cineform studio or the Pro cineform products to convert the Protune to Cineform AVI. There should be a red "C" down bottom right in your Windows display (Cineform Status). Changes made in this will be reflected by metadata in the Cineform handling in real time. But I don't see gamma there. Are you sure it is 2.2 by default? It seems pretty linear (1.0) here... I haven't shot any test wedges with it yet, though...

  • trevmartrevmar

    @BlueBomberTurbo The 1080/24T/Narrow mode has a LOT of noise compared with 1080/24T/Medium. Maybe two f-stops of noise, making the narrow mode not useful indoors, IMO. Similar to the noise in the 4K mode. But thanks for finding it for us, in any case :)

    The Touch LCD gives a 'beep' in disgust when you select mode change when the camera is in narrow :)

  • stoneystoney

    @trevmar Thanks. Darn...

    BTW the protune enabled files have lots of shadow data and some of highlight data clipping. What has been the most popular way to bring back the details? GoPro Cineform Studio Premium/Pro? 5DtoRGB?

    I've played with the free version of GoPro Cineform Studio. By default it exports with gamma 2.2. I changed the gamma to inverse 1.8, but it had no effect. Is this a bug?

  • trevmartrevmar

    @stonebat From my post above "WiFi is an additional 45ma" which is around 10% of the total battery drain, even in idle.

  • KihlianKihlian

    @5thwall Great, music from?

  • stoneystoney

    A screen capture from today's take.

    1. QuickTime screen capture from playing 1080p24 protune raw file in logarithm format. No curve applied. It looks flat.

    2. 5DtoRGB transcoded. 601 and full range and gamma 1.0 settings. It still looks flat. This step might have been unnecessary.

    3. Imported the transcoded file into After Effects. Adjusted master curve. It seems red channel is boosted and blue channel is suppressed by default.

    Screen Shot 2012-12-18 at 11.34.07 PM-barebone.png
    1790 x 1058 - 3M
    Screen Shot 2012-12-19 at 12.46.22 AM-barebone-5dtorgb.png
    1790 x 1058 - 3M
    GOPR0007-5dtorgb.jpg
    1920 x 1080 - 1M
  • stoneystoney

    If the wireless feature is on, will it drain more battery power even if the smartphone is in idle mode? What if the GoPro app is running in the background job mode?

  • stoneystoney

    Thanks BBT.

  • 5thwall5thwall

    Finally got a chance to mess with my suction cup car mount. Shot 2.7k 23.98. Also did a .5 sec stop motion at 12MP. Found that it was best when mounted to the windshield from the outside. Haven't tried it on the inside yet.

  • BlueBomberTurboBlueBomberTurbo

    With Protune off, you can get 1080p Wide, Medium, and Narrow, and 720p in Wide and Narrow. With Protune On, you can only get 1080p Wide and Medium, and 720p Wide. With the App, you can get back both 1080p and 720p Narrow with Protune on. Both my cams and app are updated to the newest versions.

  • stoneystoney

    BBT, can you elaborate? Are you talking about Protune installed in Black edition by default?

  • BlueBomberTurboBlueBomberTurbo

    Nope, it's just based on the amount of light it lets through. 24/25/30 is superior to 48/50/60, which is superior to 100/120. And don't even bother with 240 at night ;) Unless you absolutely need slow motion, or dislike motion blur more than noise, stick with 30fps and slower at night.

  • konjowkonjow

    Thanks. is there a big difference in that meter between 25 and 24fps?

  • BlueBomberTurboBlueBomberTurbo

    24fps in 2.7K will be best. Add Protune with CamRAW WB if you want to make it even better in post.

  • konjowkonjow

    Do we know which settings (resolution, frame rate) is best for low light fist position. in terms of noise?

  • HallvallaHallvalla

    Nice find, BBT.

  • BlueBomberTurboBlueBomberTurbo

    Some interesting stuff I just discovered: there are modes you can access via the app that aren't available directly from the camera. You can now use 1080p60 and 720p120 in Narrow FOV with Protune. Great if you don't want the fisheye angle or distortion. Still has a little, but nothing detrimental to image quality like correcting Wide FOV (blurs around the edges). Might be more stuff in there I haven't found yet, either.

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