to be COMPLETELY fair, this topic shouldn't compare BMD to any other camera manufacture, because BMD has 2 years under their belt making cameras, while the rest of them 20+ years? Not to mention BMD throws everything that people were wanting into an affordable camera and leave the rest up to you. They give us something better than 8bit, uncompressed, and a higher resolution than 1080 and people try to find things wrong with it? Sure there will be growing pains and bumps in the road with them, even Panasonic isn't on point when it comes to marketing and distribution (gh3).

Some of their business decisions have been a little odd, but the people let them hear about it, and from what I can tell BMD listens to the customers, they just aren't 110% when it comes to being "a solid camera manufacture"

I can honestly say the BMCC isn't for everyone, not even close. It's an affordable camera because of the other "hidden cost" SSDs, a computer able to handle RAW, storage, microphone, lens/speed booster option, rigs rigs and more rigs to pick from. In a way, BMD made a "camera"...."film/cinema camera" as they advertise it, in the same fashion of how traditional cameras that shot on film were. Mics were not built in, lights were used in "low light"(not depending on the camera being able to see in the dark), you can't delete film, and so on....

The only thing I can see hurting BMD the most is the MagicLantern buzz and how it's an even more affordable way to shoot raw video. You can go to walmart and buy a camera that shoots raw video...see why it might be hard to compete with that? lol

I think this topic should closed or be put on pause for 5 years, just to see what happens. Lets see if Canon eventually conforms to lower pricing...It's going to be hard for them to sell $30,000 cameras when ML is turning $3000 cameras into $50,000 cameras. Keep in mind BMD probably didn't realize their camera would boom like it did, especially with other "near future" affordable raw option on the horizon (bolex and so on)

Time will tell everything, no need to try and analyze every situation. When you watch a movie, do you really want to know how it ends in the middle, or would you rather be completely blown away like "WHAT THE..." Before it's all said and done Apple may be king of video cameras, with the help of GoPro or whoever.

As a "non pro" and a hobbyist I personally think the BM line are niche products. For example the BMCC/BMPCC Great for enthusiasts who want to cock about with 2k/4k/raw. not so great for joe public. And joe public is where the moneys at. So maybe BM will need to make consumer based products. btw Reids opinion that the BMCC/BMPCC will kill the video modes that the other companies impliment (canon/sony/panasonic etc) is just his own.

@BurnetRhoades

50D does 1080P RAW in crop mode (which means 3x, similar to BMPCC). In crop mode there's almost no aliasing/moirè and it holds perfectly until you fill the card.

Drawbacks are no audio and the enormous amount of storage we need.

@Mimirsan "Joe Public" can eat AVCHD. He already has dozens of cameras to choose from. BMD should ignore this demographic entirely.

That will be interesting, considering they can't fill demand for the cameras with almost no money spent on marketing. Chasing the average consumer is where they'll get into trouble. You've got it backwards.

That's an over-saturated market dominated by manufacturers adept at creating dumbed down product and consumers that don't want to think about how they use the product. These cameras have proven too much for a lot of enthusiasts and prosumers. They're positioned where the big dogs have nothing and don't "get it".

You've got it backwards. You're trying to concoct a self-fulfilling prophesy.

If they're not taking a loss per unit, if they're selling as fast as they can be made then you don't have a chart or graph that would represent anything but making the mistake of being greedy, moving into a market they've never catered to before (they don't sell consumer anything).

It's thinking like that that nearly sunk Apple in the '90s when Jobs made the mistake of hiring a soft drink executive to run the company, getting the boot. Sculley made the mistake of wanting to increase their market share and go after unsophisticated customers that had never been part of their demographic, fracturing their product line into meaningless, redundant, overlapping, bland models (see: consumer cameras), chasing more customers willing to spend less. That's just simple capitalist thinking without passion for what the company actually is and their core customers.

Go on with your exercise though.

@BurnetRhodes

In an ideal world. BMD cant ignore average joe in order to really compete with the bigger companies in the camera market. All it would take is one of them to make a camera delivering similar as a BMCC then its game over for BM. They probably wont ever do that though...no money to be made from the wider consumers. ;-)

Also Not everybody cares about 4k or 4.2.2 or dynamic range or prores/raw

I know I dont because im an average joe...when I buy a camera I want it to work out of the box and not be damanding me to work for it. Then theres storing big files to edit. BMD products is overkill for what is just family videos or a hobby that a huge percentage people buy cameras for. As average joe I will get one when the process is less painful. :-D

For big moneymaking business its about the wider demographic...maybe they should make some pink models with mp4 codec that will directly upload edit itself and output on social network sites. ;-)

They were founded in 1984 and it's never been a part of their company culture or products.

Can you provide me sources of money this company used for their purchases of other companies and stuff?

Just with references, please :-) As it is super interesting question, in fact.

Can you provide me sources of money this company ...

No, I don't work there and am not interested in whether they have some sugar daddy somewhere. I only know the company going back way before any of this based on their NLE equipment in 2001 and broadcast equipment prior to that.

Selling broadcast and production equipment is the most logical source of funds, given that's what they've been doing all along. The cameras don't affect that business.

edit: acquiring specialized software companies doesn't have to involve a lot of money either. Pinnacle's whole model was based on this because software companies making specialized stuff are almost always on the ragged edge of disappearing. Pinnacle stretched itself too thin, doing nothing terribly well and allowing previously attractive solutions to languish and go un-supported until they were finally an easy target and have been passed around a couple times.

They're (these software companies) a completely different world from the stupid billion dollar transactions that happen for blogs and sites of no value beyond their number of visitors. A lot of very cool software has just disappeared because they deal with a limited viable customer base and the ease of software piracy. You can't pirate a camera, or a switcher, or a NLE accelerator or other piece of gear.

I love what BM is doing by pushing the market forward with their high quality, low-cost camera solutions. However, it is extremely puzzling to me that they don't have the basics in their cameras (ability to delete clips, audio levels, etc.). If they are truly making "pro" cameras, they need to step up their game in that regard. In the end, it's great to have companies like Red and BM in the market to shake up the big boys. :)

It might be of interest, my investment/expenditure with BMD products over last two years:

Cameras is $2300, the MFT Cinema Camera
Others total $8800

AUD

Found right next to the Microsoft Surface plot at Forest Lawn! Well, BM might still live to a hundred:)

I read many interesting references and materials on topic (in additional to data I knew). And want to change approach slightly as it seems like it'll be more fun.