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25p official topic, aka Don't cry for me Argentina
  • 236 Replies sorted by
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    @_gl
    I was kinda joking! ;-)
  • stipstip
    I'm trying to understand but I don't.
    Is 25p for GH2 ruled out now or not?

    > In upcoming PTool you'll see quite stable 25p, but. It only has first field in top part, below is garbage.

    So despite the sensor not having 25fps setup there will be a 25p option - but it won't work. Will it never work or is there a chance that it can be fixed?

    I'm confused?!
  • LPowellLPowell
    Vitaliy said:
    "GH2 don't have 25p mode amongst sensor setup modes.
    24fps, 50fps, 60fps, 120fps, but no 25fps."

    It seems the hacked GH1 will remain the best solution for PAL 25p recording purposes. The best results I've obtained are with the 100Mbps Max Latitude Native 24/25p Patch:

    http://www.personal-view.com./talks/discussion/162/100mbps-max-latitude-patch-v2-updated-for-ptool-3.55d#Item_23
  • _gl_gl
    @Mimirsan, give V. a chance, maybe 50p can be made to work.
  • _gl_gl
    > frazier is shot 24p on 35mm right? but we dont know what it is cut to. i assume it would be cut at 29.97 because of part durations needing to be exact.

    Not sure, but part of the reason for shooting 24p could have been the easier conversion to PAL without horrible pulldown, so I would assume it was cut on 24p and then conformed.

    > i dont remember ntsc>pal conversions having a duration change, so there shouldnt be a pitch shift, or speed shift between american and english versions,

    Yes there was - see Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PAL_speedup#576i_speed-up

    "Motion pictures are typically shot on film at 24 frames per second. When telecined and played back at 576i25's standard of 25 frames per second, films run 4% faster. This also applies to most TV series that are shot on film or digital 24p.[2] Unlike 480i30's telecine system, which uses 3:2 pulldown to convert the 24 frames per second to the 480i30 frame rate, 576i results in the telecined video running 4% shorter than the original film as well as the equivalent 480i30 telecined video."

    "Depending on the sound system in use, it also slightly increases the pitch of the soundtrack by 70.67 cents (0.7067 of a semitone). More recently, digital conversion methods have used algorithms which preserve the original pitch of the soundtrack, although the frame rate conversion still results in faster playback."
  • _gl_gl
    > 50 FPS divided by 2 equals 25 FPS. That would work just as well if not better.

    Right it's better because you have a choice between 50p and 25p from the same footage - the downside is that you loose the 1/25 shutter speed option for low-light (or dreamy blur).
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    Well might give the next Ptool a go first...Im a bit of curiosity whore lol
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    >Well off to sell my GH2...toodles!

    :-)
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    >1080 50p is posible

    Looking at sensor setup I don't think so.
    GH2 sensor speed looks almost the same as in GH1 (G2 is slower).
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    Well off to sell my GH2...toodles!
  • andresandres
    Sad Sad news, hope the 1080 50p si posible, on the other way, I just got a gh1 instead of the gh2, so for me is not that bad.
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    In GH1 we changed encoder.
    In GH2 it don't work this way.
    In upcoming PTool you'll see quite stable 25p, but. It only has first field in top part, below is garbage.
  • MimirsanMimirsan
    High bitrate 720 50p will be fine for me as long as I dont have to use the 24p cine record first doobery.
    There wasnt 25p on GH1 originally but you managed to get native 25p out of the 50i...so if possible this way?
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    @feha
    Variable modes are separate modes, they are not defined by percent.
    But it could be interesting to look how they skip frames.
  • sparedogsparedog
    @_gl frazier is shot 24p on 35mm right? but we dont know what it is cut to. i assume it would be cut at 29.97 because of part durations needing to be exact.
    the uk versions are supplied on tape, right? so they are would be supplied ntsc and then transcoded to pal. in sd days, i dont remember ntsc>pal conversions having a duration change, so there shouldnt be a pitch shift, or speed shift between american and english versions, only between the live studio viewings and the final cuts. was there a duration change in ntsc>pal conversions of sd?
    tricky one, gonna to try to find out more on this
  • mpgxsvcdmpgxsvcd
    50 FPS divided by 2 equals 25 FPS. That would work just as well if not better.
  • sparedogsparedog
    120fps? is this possible at 720 or 1080?
  • _gl_gl
    > GH2 don't have 25p mode amongst sensor setup modes.
    24fps, 50fps, 60fps, 120fps, but no 25fps.

    50p is a nice second-best : ).
  • fehafeha
    Thanks, no hope ...
    Other question:
    There is a variable movie mode ...
    Can you hack that with percent ?
    104 % would be a 25p :-)
    The max is 300%, if it could be hacked to 1000 or 2000 % perfect for timelapse ...
  • skiandbikeskiandbike
    > 24fps, 50fps, 60fps, 120fps, but no 25fps

    120fps is just for fast focus, correct?
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    @zigizigi
    Interesting stuff is that according to our testing of GH1.
    MJPEG uses 60fps setup. At least this is how I understand it.
  • zigizigizigizigi
    End of story. Thanks for clarifying.
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev
    Guys, just to note.
    GH2 don't have 25p mode amongst sensor setup modes.
    24fps, 50fps, 60fps, 120fps, but no 25fps.
  • _gl_gl
    > I can see why it would be a lot more noticeable for Frasier, being slowed down by 17%!

    Apparently it was shot on 24p film, so the difference is only 4%, like a normal 25p conform - it tallies with the audio resampling I did yesterday. It doesn't sound like much on paper, but it really is quite different to my ears.

    @feha, I'd be happier if 25p would just go away and everybody would use 24p. SD TV's were mostly stuck with their local fps, but luckily HD TVs all support 24p now for Blu-ray movies. We just have to kill 25p in broadcasting : ). But for now we're stuck with it ...
  • fehafeha
    Conclusion: 25p is a must :-)
    wah, wah, wah ...
    If PAL camera why not PAL Cinema 25 p ?
    wah, wah, wah ... uff Pana...
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