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Encoders in NLEs and GPU support
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    If you look at NLE export and encoders you will see one interesting thing. They live in the past.

    Most of them offer average and below average encoders that works slow and at best use some Intel QuickSync abilities.

    In real life you have two options:

    • Compact, best possible quality for client distribution - need usage of CPU based x264 and x265 encoders.
    • Youtube, Facebook and such uploads - here you need only fixed block encoding, best is fastest even if it will be larger (as another GPU will reencode it anyway)

    Most fun thing is that only few NLEs has any support of very powerful decoding/encoding blocks of AMD/Nvidia GPUs.

    Hardware support by NLEs, export H.264 encoding only

    As of September 2017

    • Premiere Pro CC 2017 - NVENC (via plugin), QuickSync
    • MAGIX Video Pro X8 and X9 - QuickSync
    • MAGIX Magix Movie Edit Pro 2017 - QuickSync
    • MAGIX Vegas Pro 15 - NVENC, QuickSync, VCE in plans
    • Edius 8.5 and 9 - QuickSync
    • Davinci Desolve 14 - QuickSync only in Studio version, free version specially crippled
    • Sony Catalyst Edit 2017 - NVENC, QuickSync.
    • Corel VideoStudio PRO X10 - NVENC, VCE, QuickSync
    • Movavi Video Editor - NVENC, QuickSync
    • CyberLink PowerDirector 15 and 16 - NVENC, VCE, QuickSync
    • Nero Video 2018 - NCENC, NVDEC, QuickSync
    • TMPGEnc Video Mastering Works - NVENC, CUDA, VCE, QuickSync.
  • 24 Replies sorted by
  • geoffcbassettgeoffcbassett

    All the H264 encoders suck in the editors. I always export as high a quality as possible then Run it through Handbrake. I have no idea when they are going to smarten up and add more options.

    In youtube uploads it doesn't matter because your not limited on size. In Vimeo however it is much more important when you are limited on size of uploads per week depending on which service you have. Handbrakes H265 encoding is a godsend in this case. I had to upload a 30 minute project in 4K and get it under 5gb, not possible out of premiere or Resolve with anything near okay quality.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    In youtube uploads it doesn't matter because your not limited on size. In Vimeo however it is much more important when you are limited on size of uploads per week depending on which service you have. Handbrakes H265 encoding is a godsend in this case. I had to upload a 30 minute project in 4K and get it under 5gb, not possible out of premiere or Resolve with anything near okay quality.

    I strongly suggest to try

    http://bluesky23.yukishigure.com/en/AsVideoConv.html

    And Handbreak is mostly very PR heavy fluff made for smartphone transcodes.

  • EspenBEspenB

    "DaVinci Resolve 14 features an incredible new video playback engine with CPU and GPU optimizations"

    However, when I look for encoding claims they are nowhere to be found.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    "DaVinci Resolve 14 features an incredible new video playback engine with CPU and GPU optimizations"

    Well, as for my tests Resolve 14 still sucks. Just simple 4K H.264 footage playback on 2 core notebook sucks, and it has Intel DXVA and dedicated graphics card also with 4K DXVA and that can play same file with almost zero load using good player.

  • caveportcaveport

    I get fantastic H.264 quality from both FCPX and Premiere on Mac OSX. I really don't understand why Windows users have so much trouble. My occasional Windows sessions also give great quality H.264 from Premiere and Avid. DaVinci Resolve output quality is still very average with H.264 but it's still being developed from a grading only software to a full editing software. It will take a few more versions before they can improve the playback & encoding pipeline to equal Avid, Premiere or FCPX performance. There is still a lot of old legacy code in Resolve.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @caveport

    Topic is not about "great quality", as it is same category as "smooth sound".

    It is about fact that they do not use two best techs available - encoding using best slow and tunable CPU based encoders, and ultra fast hardware encoders.

  • alcomposeralcomposer

    @caveport I can confirm that FCPX is indeed using GPU for encoding H264. I have checked GPU usage when exporting, and its always active.

    As for Resolve, I don't really think that export to H264 is on their high priority list. Its lineage is mainly for high end finishing. So not distribution.

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev I have also had no issue with Handbreak. Makes really great H264 - very usable and customisable- also uses 100% of CPU resources. (no GPU yet).

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    I have also had no issue with Handbreak. Makes really great H264 - very usable and customisable- also uses 100% of CPU resources. (no GPU yet).

    I never said about problems with it. I said that other converters exist with better GPU support.

    And I really hate batch approach in Handbreak, made by some idiot.

  • alcomposeralcomposer

    @Vitaliy_Kiselev I have a love hate relationship with Handbreak. But mostly love.

    When I use it I just remind myself I need more cores. I'm just happy that it uses them all.

    As for GPU, I think that currently its all a bit of a mess. Unless you look at 3D Rendering software or games - not many industries use them to their fullest extent.

    (And 3D rendering is mostly hit and miss)

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    As for GPU, I think that currently its all a bit of a mess. Unless you look at 3D Rendering software or games - not many industries use them to their fullest extent.

    It is developers skills that are not good, not GPUs.

  • alcomposeralcomposer

    GPU's are very specialised to code for I believe, and constantly changing with multiple standards: CUDA vs OpenCL.

    Not to mention countless driver issues on both fronts. CPU seems more robust on that front.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @alcomposer

    Well, it is duopoly for long time. Not so much changes. Smaller cards are same as large just with cut units.

    OpenCL performance of NVidia is quite good now.

    It all just require skill and knowledge.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Moved topic to Editors, as will be adding lot of info soon.

    Added info to top post for now. Will add more later.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    QuickSync supporting editors:

    • CyberLink MediaShow
    • CyberLink PowerDirector
    • Grass Valley EDIUS
    • MAGIX Video Pro X and MEP
    • Roxio
    • Corel Pinnacle Studio 19
    • Sony Catalyst Media Production
    • Adobe Premiere Elements
  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Real tragedy for NLE developers

    As both AMD Ryzen and upcoming Threadstripper do not support QuickSync.

    Same is true for upcoming Intel i9 processors, as they have whole GPU block removed.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Good news

    Hardware accelerated Encoding/Decoding

    VEGAS Pro 15 leverages modern hardware for accelerated encoding and decoding, including support for Intel Quick Sync Video (QSV) and other technologies.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Vegas 15 update upon release

    • NVENC support for 1GB or more GeForce (6xx, 7xx, 9xx, 10xx) and Quadro Kxxx, Mxxx and Pxxx cards
    • NVDEC not supported yet
    • Decoder/encoder on AMD not supported. Radeon HD 57xx or higher GPU for transitions and effects.
    • QuickSync. Intel Skylake or newer for 8-bit HEVC/AVC, Intel KabyLake or newer for 10-bit HEVC encoding and decoding.

    Top post updated with current versions also

  • sammysammy

    VK does that mean we finally have smooth playback of 4k prore?

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @sammy

    ProRes has nothing to do hardware encoders and decoders. This is topic about them.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Top post updated, NeroVideo 2018, Edius 9, Powerdirector 16 added.

  • brianlbrianl

    Any have h265 encoder/decoder?

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    @brianl

    Most editors now support HEVC, usually most that have hardware acceleration for decoding support both (on proper hardware). For encoding it is separate and depends on software team mostly.

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Pinnacle Studio 21 added

    Corel VideoStudio PRO updated to X10.5

  • Vitaliy_KiselevVitaliy_Kiselev

    Premiere Pro supports hardware-accelerated H.264 encoding on Windows 10 with 6th Generation (or later) Intel® Core™ processors and Intel Graphics enabled, and hardware-accelerated H.264 and HEVC encoding on Mac OS 10.13 systems with supported hardware.

    It sounds strange, seems more like they removed all support under older OS and older CPUs and presented it as advancement.

    As for After effects, all sucks

    You can now use the hardware decoders in your system to speed up the process of editing H.264 file formats on Windows.

    Start with enabling the Enable Accelerated H.264 Decoding option in Preferences > Import, then restart After Effects. The option does not work if the CPU of your computer does not support Intel Quick Sync Video.

    Support details

    • H.264 video in MPEG-4 (.mp4) and QuickTime (.mov) containers are hardware accelerated.
    • MPEG Transport Stream (.mts) containers are not supported.
    • Only 4:2:0 8-bit per channel files are supported because of hardware limitations.

    Looks like they have big problems with normal developers.

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