Personal View site logo
Make sure to join PV on Telegram or Facebook! Perfect to keep up with community on your smartphone.
Driftwood - Experimental Series 2: Low Rider, Cluster v8, V9, Intravenus II, GH3onaGH2, AN, Boom
  • 1007 Replies sorted by
  • @filthy I think you just about pulled everything you could out of the GH2. Nicely done.

  • @vicharris - Thanks for the compliment! Have learned a ton from everyone here.

  • Just tried out Intravenous II on some nature shots, and I have a question. I shot some local woods around midday with the standard Panasonic 14-42 lens, ISO 640, and there weren't any extreme dark areas of what I was shooting. But when I looked at the footage when I got home, there was a lot of digital noise present. Maybe this was due to my watching this on Windows Media Player, but... well, has anyone else had noise problems with Intravenous II?

  • @Brian_Siano - Might the noise bug issue. Pretty known issue with GH2. Also ISO 640 is supposed to be unusually noisier than the rest. Been discussed plenty around here. Just do a search for both topics to find the workaround.

  • All good with Intravenus II for me. No noise issues

  • i love iso 640 more after some tests i've done. didn't try intravenus but i use moon t5 and it is really good! especially for noise.

  • Maybe I'll try it again, and Moon might be worth trying. I did the ISO bug fix thing, i.e., switch to 800 and then switched down to 640.

  • IV has always had the best "Across the board" noise pattern for me. One of the things I like about it. Have you put it on scopes and see if those areas were underexposed? Even if they looked good in cam, they might have been in the 20 and below range on a waveform monitor which will bring in much more noise than the rest of the footage.

  • @vicharris: The areas with the noise didn't seem underexposed to me: they were actually pale grey areas of the scene (the side of a stone bridge), and when I shot the scene I'd adjusted the exposure and shutter to get the histogram right in the middle of the scale. Maybe I should upload the footage to Vimeo for review. But for now, I'll rely on the Cake patch for general-purpose stuff, and the next time I'm up at the Wissahickon I'll give the Moon patch a workout.

  • I'm pretty new to this, but I'm also getting noise with Intravenus II. It's nice when there's light, but when it's darker, it's like this (see attached file). Does that count as noise (in such conditions)? 14-42 mm kit lense, f5.6, 125 shutter, 160 iso, smooth all -2.

    vlcsnap-2013-06-08-17h29m41s224.png
    1920 x 1080 - 3M
  • IV2's noise is one of the best things about the patch IMO. It looks more like real film grain than digital noise, even moreso when shooting B&W in ETC for the too-cool Hunter's Tri-X trick. IV2 is the only Driftwood patch I like and leave the noise in - in fact, a few times early on I NeatVideo'd IV2 footage and then decided it looked better without the NR.

    Of course YMMV if you're going for the more modern grainless RED/Arri/Sherlock look. To my eyes IV2 looks like 35mm film and I'm more than fine with its noise character. There are guys trying to sell you $99 Final Cut and AE plug-ins to add film grain that don't look as good as IV2's noise.

  • @bernardlv You're shooting in a dark room at base ISO 160 with a slow kit lens at f5.6 and doing so at 60fps so you're starving your sensor even further with a 1/120 shutter. It's sort of the perfect storm of sensor starvation. Try upping your ISO to 800 or even 1250, shoot your kit lens at the wide end to get f3.5 and a lot more light in, and maybe try shooting 24P with a 1/40 or even 1/30 shutter. You can't starve the GH2's sensor like you're doing and expect clean footage. Let there be light.

  • @Shaveblog I'm pretty sure it was in the 24p mode, and wouldn't I increase the noise if I upped the ISO? I only zoomed in with f5.6 to make the noise more visible, I know that GH2 unfortunately is a light vacuum. I'll just repatch in case anything went wrong, the video was pretty good in better light conditions.

    Edit: If anyone is curious, how Intravenus II looks in better conditions with the standard kit (more light, f3.5 and 320 ISO). I guess I was just asking too much of the GH2 with the shitty kit lense before.

    vlcsnap-2013-06-08-19h01m40s130.png
    1920 x 1080 - 3M
  • @bernardlv Shooting at base ISO 160 does you no favors if you're shooting in low light conditions - whatever benefits you might get from shooting at a low ISO are swamped by the noise penalty you incur from starving the sensor of light. The GH2 shooting IV2 is relatively clean up to ISO 1250 I find, with 1600 usable with a bit of NeatVideo NR to clean it up later. Don't be afraid to shoot at ISO 400 or 800 - these ISOs are your friends, and feed the sensor enough light to produce good looking footage. Get your exposure up between 0 and +2 on the GH2's meter and you'll start seeing lower noise and much cleaner footage.

    A half empty chip bag in a dark room is not how you learn how to do this stuff. Get out and shoot the real world. You'll quickly learn to match ISO with aperture with shutter and get the right combo for most any real-world setting. Takes some experimentation, but you'll get it, we all started where you are.

    PS don't shoot 24P with a 1/120 shutter unless you want Saving Private Ryan stutter motion effects on your chip bag. Try 1/40 shutter or even 1/30 shutter for more film-like motion blur. 1/50 if you feel those two are too blurry for what you're trying to achieve. 1/120 is for when you shoot 60P. The lower shutters will also let in a lot more light and help you out with that slow kit lens.

  • @Shaveblog Thanks. Check this thread out tho - http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/1280/gh2-iso-noise-bug-at-320-640-and-1250/p1.

    I'm not sure if this is a big deal, but the camera (with IV 2) didn't let me shoot 720p 60p for longer than 7-11 seconds unless I restarted it, the error said that my card was too slow even tho it's the Sandisk extreme one.

  • @bernardlv Yes, there is apparently a "noise bug" some GH2 users have noticed on certain ISOs. The solution some have found is to set the camera for a higher ISO than what you wish to use, and then toggle down to the right ISO. Me, I shoot at ISO 400 or 800 99% of the time and never get any kind of noise bug with or without the toggling. You'll find that the "noise bug" seems to vary for different complainants, and there's no universal consensus on its solution. My advice is to try shooting 400 and 800 and see if you get noisy footage. Try 1250 in very dark conditions. Also, get yourself some faster and better glass - hit up eBay for the Lumix 14mm f2.5 pancake for $170. Infinitely better looking glass than the kit lens. Not the fastest lens in the world but faster than the 14-42 and quite a bit better to boot. I blew this lens off when it first hit but it's seriously great, a gem. And much better suited to video than the 20mm pancake.

    FWIW I never saw the "noise bug" on my GH2, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist for some users and some cameras. Remember, it's a Chinese made consumer product and maybe the Chinese part doesn't really matter anymore all things considered but the main thing is it's not an artisanal piece of gear, it's a commodity item mass produced by people who don't care if every fast moving target on an assembly line meets spec. Sometimes a bunch of bad iPhones/GH2s/BMWs go out the door and some end users complain on forums and it becomes "all ____ have this problem" when in fact only some do.

    If you're worried about a possible GH2 issue you read about on a forum, test it for yourself. Takes 10 seconds. If it affects your camera, drill down and find the solution. If it's not an issue for your camera, yay, one less thing to worry about.

    Finally, try shooting 1080/24P instead of 720/60P. Unless you're a soccer dad or shooting Mexican soap operas, why do you want 60P? May as well forget the GH2 and just get an LX7 or G5, call it a day.

  • @Shaveblog Oh, I didn't know that only certain GH2 users are affected by it, I'm glad you're not (in that case I was just pointing out that you could be, haha)!

    Most of the footage I take is 1080/24p, but I might need the 60p, for example for fast action shots or to make some more dynamic. Just thought I'd let it know for any future improvements.

    And yeah, I'm thinking of getting a new lens this summer. Do you have any videos for me with your f2.5? :>

  • No, I don't have any video for you, what's the point? Buying lenses based on seeing a stranger’s compressed clips online which allegedly used said lenses is pointless. Not to be curt, but either take advice or don't. Google the Lumix 14mm or search the many threads here discussing its quality for video. $170 is peanuts to try a new lens, especially one of the handful for m43 this wide and fast.

  • Having wrong gamma setting on monitor makes a huge diffrence on how you see noise on monitor.

  • I'm finding that I really like Intravenus II. I still see HF shimmering but it's the nature of the camera I guess. But this patch seems like it has a smooth, cinematic feel to it and I think will be my go to for a lot of things. Moon Trial 5 seemed a bit too sharp for me, although admittedly I have not done a side by side with the two hacks to compare on same lens, same content.

    Anyway, nice job with this one!

  • Does Moon Trial 5 span consistently? I can record sometimes up to 35-40 minutes and need something that will not stop for any reason. I'm really struggling to get my GH2 to match my GH3 and have tried all sorts of colour profile combinations.

    Basically the GH2 always looks really soft when compared with the GH3, it also has more contrast in the shot even at -2. Any help would be great from those that have experience with these patches.

  • @driftwood I've been trying out Quantum GH3 Matrix (GH3onaGH2) and I like it. Very smooth look and it comes in at around 53Mbps (on NTSC 24P). One very interesting thing was an actual reduction in moire. I was using a Panasonic 12-35 and came across some moire on a test using Intravenous 2. I switched lens to an old 1972 Russian Lomo 50mm and got same moire. Then I switched over to the GH3onaGH2 setting, with 12-35 lens, and the moire almost completely disappeared . (Also one nice benefit of lower bitrate is that audio plays back without stuttering.) This is a great setting. Thanks Nick

  • Wanted to show some love for the Intravenous II