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Panasonic EVA1, like in WALL-E, S35 Camera
  • 189 Replies sorted by
  • @LPowell

    Why wait for Panasonic?

    JVC really surprised everyone with dedication to their camera. I want to find people behind it and make detailed interview about history of development and updates history.

    And, btw long proper topic here is - http://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/11756/jvc-4k-cameras-including-gy-ls300-4k-for-2995-gy-hm200-and-gy-hm170

  • Panasonic needs to sell this for a lot less than the Canon C200 if they want it to sell well. The Panasonic may have the better sensor and codecs, but the Canon has autofocus, internal raw recording, and the more established brand. Even if the Panasonic sells well, it's just helping Canon sell a lot of lenses.

  • Ehhhh... Camera looks great... but $8k usd... nope. This needs to be a $4.5k camera. Needs to directly compete with Blackmagic Ursa. I don't think this cam will be that popular without a major price re-evaluation.

  • Btw, specially for some guys

    Varicam is just marketing term. Like Asus ROG Strix. Has almost nothing to do with actual technology used (despite the claims).

  • C200 will sell like crazy, this thing will be half-price in a year's time. Maybe it's not fair, but factor this into your decision to buy.

  • @theconformist

    About half the price I am very doubtful. As all firms are going for margins and tight price controls.

  • @LPowell well, you just converted me on 'no MFT for s35'. The JVC GY-LS300 just begs the question why didn't Panasonic go with MFT???????

    EDIT: looking at reviews, the DR looks like it may not be up to the GH4/5. Is that what you have found @LPowell?

  • @ alcomposer - With the JVC LS300, we shoot 4K @ 8-bit 4:2:0 J-Log1 and I resample it into 1080p @ 10-bit 4:2:2 Rec 709 for editing. The recent firmware update boosts 4K capture to 8-bit 4:2:2 color. In post, I have no issues with dynamic range or banding, the footage is a breeze to grade. (Check out the fog @2:00)

  • @LPowell great work. Good to see someone else working in performance videography. I do so much of this work, and it's actually very hard! Always changing lighting conditions.

    Sometimes this sort of work can be looked down upon, but it's a really fantastic place to learn about continuous camera operation, smooth zooms, pans etc.

  • @LPowell I was closely wathing the GY-LS300 when it was announced and a while after. However while it had many awesome features, the lack of ability to record internal or external 10bit 422 kept me from choosing that camera at that time.

    Also the real life footage I ve seen shot with it dont convince me. I dont like the higlight handling which unfortunately reminds me too much of the quirky and ugly highlights of AF100 (channels clipping unevenly). I am also left in the impression that actual usable dynamic range is not that great either? The shots I have seen also seem quite soft and seem to suffer same kind aliasing in the high contrast edges as AF100 had.

    I would like to be proven wrong or if some of these aspects has been improved via firmware upgrades later.

    Perhaps I try to find one to loan and give it a try.

    (edit) I just saw your footage. It looks really nice dynamic range wise. Only thing that bothers me is aliasing in the hard contrast edges. (though it is very light in your footage): But yes, your footage engourages me to try it out.

  • Eva1 .

    the real question is.

    why EF mount?

    Iunderstand the 400mbits due to internal limitations on prossesing. I guess is the first time panasonic offers futurely RAW through a consumer LSI. Maybe internally varicam has like 8 times the power of Gh5. So no Varicam logo on this bastard child with royal sensor specs and poor prossecing. Hahahahah thats wierd.

    well it is, SO the external recording is a must for this camera, you know to, compensate.

    IF TH DUAL GAIN is the same of the varicam 800/5000 for $9k to $8k you have a barstdycam and external recorder fully functuonal 5.7k raw camera....hmmm.. rigged to be 15k.

    From a DP view dual gain is very good.

    1) IT IS BETTER THAN FS7 MKII? 2) IT IS BETTER THAN URSA pro? 3)IT IS BETTER THAN FS5? 4)IT IS BETTWR THAN SECOND HAND RED DRAGON?

    That are actually hard questions to askif you are planning on buying on the next 6 months. .

    any of this cameras including eva1 are aprox 13 to $15k to be operational for professional use. The base rig. Mattebox .follow focus. Good lens riser/holder. Accesories. Extra battery x4 like 6 media sources SD. A HDD. Extra chgargers . External power source. Filters for matebox. Pelican Cases...wuff you put the limit.

    So... what to choose and why?

    .

  • @Jasketti - I routinely produce 10-bit 4:2:2 1080p footage using the LS300 shooting in 4K and posted an example. Do you see any blown-out yellow highlights like the AF100? Sorry, but your anti-JVC complaints sound like a years-old YouTube review. J-Log1 made a dramatic difference in this camera's DR performance. The sensor actually shows very little aliasing with its VSM digital scaling. Any hard edges you see are most likely over-agressive sharpening on my part in post.

    As for shooting 10-bit 4:2:2 in 4K, have you ever tried doing that with a 64GB SD card? The LS300 shoots 4K at 150Mbps and can record a single 64GB file 55 minutes long. That's the minimum bitrate and footage duration I'd consider acceptable for 8-bit 4:2:2 4K video recording and it's at the limit of practicality for SD cards. To record an hour-long performance in 10-bit 4:2:2 4K, I'd want an external SSD recorder running at 300+ Mbps.

  • On the interview Mitch Gross says the reason they chose EF mount was because: "..important people wanted s35 sensor..."

    Well, those two things above do not require each other in any way :) as most of us know. Who would tell panasonic desing team that? EF mount is such a horrible waste of possibilities with its enormous prehistorical flange distance.

    Electronicly coupled adapters and focal reducers allowing full electronic use of EF lenses on mFT exist today. Could someone also tell that to Panasonic desing team. Perhaps if mr. Gross reads this thread he could pass on the information :)

    There is nothing, absolutely nothing tehcnology wise stopping you from equipping EVA1 with s35 sensor and mFT mount while still being able to use EF-mount lenses with aperture, focus and IS control. Nothing at all. Everything has already been done.

  • @Jasketti

    I can name this important people - it is investors and top management.

    This guys just look for best sold similar cameras like Canon C series, Ursa, etc and want same mount hoping for big sales.

  • i agree. ef mount is bullshit for s35. In my opinion there are very few lenses designed for s35. tokina 11-16mm, canon 17-55mm efs, sigma 18-35mm, sigma 30mm. Every other lens i'm interested in was designed for full frame.

  • @cls105

    I think proper solution is special locking mount with 4 quick change adapters included - m43, E mount, PL Mount and EF mount.

  • correct. Kind of like Kine enhancer http://www.kinefinity.com/shop/k2ef-active_en/?lang=en "sub pl" to ef with focal reducer.

  • I've had a long think about the mount issue on WALL-E.

    This camera is designed to go head to head with Canon C100/200/300.

    My other thought, (and this may sound ridiculous) is that it's also intentionally designed to not take sales away from the GH5 / LUMIX system.

    So in many ways this is a battle camera, designed to lure Canon shooters into Panasonic.

    Otherwise Panasonic would have made a camera with Vitaliy's suggestion of special locking mount.

    On another note: it would be interesting to know if WALL-E uses Sony sensor as well?

  • @Vitaliy_Kiselev @cls105 @Panasonic_desing Agreed. That would the best way to go.

    I have the impression that someone from Panasonic actually follows this forum. So if you do please consider the option suggested by mr Kiselev.

    By doing that you would not only maximize the customer base and selling potential of your camera but also create yourself an extra item to be sold. The bolt-on user swappable mount. By making and selling individual mounts for mFT, EF (with FF focal reducer and without) and PL you could make extra $$$ and make users very happy campers.

    This would make sense in so many ways. EF lenses would be fully utilized, mFT mount would offer flexibility and compatibility, and PL people would get sturdy and good mount as they dont seem to like adapters anyways since PL glass is usually so heavy. Win-win-win-win and your managers would provide you with big bonuses for coming up with such a great idea.

  • @Jasketti check out my first post on this thread. I think that the idea of multi-mount is one of those 'collective consciousness' moments. :-)

  • Panny fans should not worry ,something tells me that EVA-2 is coming with MFT sensor at 3499$ After all they have space between GH5 and EVA-1, even if GH5 is in consumer division and EVA-1 in pro. I dont think EVA-1 is a smart move at this price point vs the C200, maybe 1000$ less ? Put an EVA-2 MFT 4k & .... in face of a 1080p Canon C100 M2 could be rewarding. BTW Sony will soon unveil his FS5 M2 and Fujifilm will show his X Cinema Cameras. Imho Fuji will start to compensate the end of motion picture film with cameras full of film simulations.

  • @Faudel Panny do have a space between EVA1 & GH5. I would personally like to see a "GH5 Pro" released. 14+ stops DR & improved low light. (not much to do on LSI side, 400mbps is fine).

    Add to that some better MFT lenses for video, better zooms (Parfocal at 2.8) and primes with advanced focus control.

  • @alcomposer fair enough and true. This should further add weigth to @Panasonic_design decision as it seems to be a general opinion here that a user swappable mount would be the way to go.

    @Faudel could be but with the speed pana does their development it could take another 7-10 years til EVA-2 :)

    GH5 Pro would do fine. Simply a GH5 in a filmcamera form factor, XLR, ND filters or better yet electronic variND, 10bit 4:2:2 4K 50/60P ProRes (or equivalent). Thats it. Even better if it had s35 sensor.

    A standard SSD drive media sled for recording would also be appreciated.

    Ok pana, when will this above described EVA2 (GH5pro) come out?

    P.S. I have grown to hate rigging and fiddling with DSLM stills camera form factor. We want true videocams please.

    (edit) will be interesting to see what Fuji comes out with and where they will postion themselves pricewise.

  • @Jasketti I'm still very interested in light cameras for Video & Stills. Its fantastic to be able to use a light weight gimbal and camera system that has so many built in features.

    Why I like the GH5 for video:

    • Flip out good LCD screen
    • Good video in-camera
    • Long record time
    • Small form-factor
    • Can transform into a usable still camera (shoot in RAW)
    • Sensor with IBS
    • Sensor not too big and thus smaller lenses possible (if companies choose to make them)

    What I dislike:

    • Dynamic Range is never enough, need 14+ for stills and video. (My D810 has 15 and I love it)
    • Better low light (GH5 is MUCH better than GH4- but more would be appreciated.)

    Thats what I would like to see in EVA-2 / GH5 Pro.